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Because you can does not mean you should
Our contributor Matthew Burbridge writes:
There’s a new app called Moises which uses AI to extract the various instruments from a mix. It is great for musicians to create a backing tracking by removing for example the guitar or vocals. They used a similar thing to extract the different instruments on The Beatles’ Revolver which was recorded using a 4 track and remixed it.
I have actually used it to separate the bass from Stargazer as it is really low in the mix, so I can re-mix it with more bass. However, I think the bass needs beefing up a bit, as on its own it sounds weak.
However, this chap has separated out the vox from 72 Highway Star and removed the vox from the video and then applied the 72 vox to the video. I have not listened to it all as IMHO it’s pointless: A fun exercise but why bother other than “because you can”.
We agree with the last sentiment — a transplant is still a transplant. That being said, we, as always, welcome our new robotic overlords.
Unauthorized copying, while sometimes necessary, is never as good as the real thing
Yo, it may good to use for some of those dodgy bootlegs that can sometimes find their way into your collection, by removing noise & possibly enhancing other aspects etc etc.
At the moment, I use my digital-recorder to help with such improvements, where I’ll use the Windows Graphic Equalizer (found in enhancements on the lap-top) to improve the original sound on playback, with generally the 1-KHz frequency reduced around 50% or so, that then reveals what the other frequencies are doing, or not doing for the sound…You can pretty-much reduce all the tape-hiss by reducing say the 4-KHz frequency, & then slowly play-around with the others to satisfy your needs. You’ll generally find that there is one frequency where “bass guitar” can be enhanced, & another where the “treble” frequencies are improved…Typically, I listen for the clarity of the drummers cymbals, & leave the setting when I can hear them clearly. Once satisfied, you then record your newly EQ’d recording(s) into your digital recorder, where you can either raise or lower recording levels…Keep the average levels floating around the -6db, with occasional spikes higher for best results. If you go higher than this, the sound will change from your enhancements on the new recording, & you’ll have to do it again, & too low levels mean that your volume dial has to be increased for playback, so your amp works harder & possible other out-side noise will be introduced.
Also, you don’t need to purchase a digital recorder per-se, as playing & recording into another computer is the same thing. There’s a free programme called Audacity that will help with the new “mic-in” recording levels, & set it to 75% & you’re away. No suspicious “AI” introduced into your computer(s) lol, & much improved sound quality achieved…Trust your ears as to what sounds good…And don’t spend hours perfecting the sound by fiddling around too much. 5-minutes is all you need to set-up your sound. Beyond that, your ears will have adjusted too far away from “normal” & your mix will be spoiled.
I hope this helps some folks out !
Peace !
November 3rd, 2022 at 00:30A young Gillan singing with a matured Deep Purple sounds weird, like an overeager tribute act. Truth is: While Big Ian has lost range and power over half a century, he has also gained something in his voice and I miss that with the young Gillan. An interesting experiment though nothing more or less.
But Sir Matthew, please share your extracted Stargazer bass track with us, I’d really like to hear it! I have always wondered what a bass might sound like on that record. After all, there is a bass guitarist pictured in the inner gatefold and on the back so perhaps he has even played somewhere? I’m eager to find out.
[The mix of Rising was incredibly rushed crap (the NY mix is plain horrible/grating on the ear, like a(n) (Iggy & the) Stooges record in fact, but even the LA one is less than decent). Even Blackmore has said so.]
November 3rd, 2022 at 13:07I cannot imagine Gillan from back then singing nowadays with Purple. Curiosity will NOT be killing this cat this time around. In regards to Rainbow Rising I have yet to purchase the album on cd due to the poor reviews both editions get from fans. I have the Polydor double best of Rainbow cd. That has most of the RR tracks I like (missing Tarot Woman) & yes the bass guitar & general sound is dry & not the best, it never has been even on vinyl. It needs a remix the same as Sabbath’s Born Again does. A reviewer on Amazon who has the 2011 RR release said that he talked with Jimmy Bain about the bass missing & Bain said that the record company didn’t like too much bass & it was remixed for that reason. That sounds to me like Bain being a touch sarcastic there. Anyway most Rainbow aficionados are not happy either. It would be good to hear this guys ‘new bass’ sound on it, although he may be being careful as to do that, who knows how legitimate that is. Cheers.
November 4th, 2022 at 04:46BTW that’s the clip of DP in Toronto doing live Aid 2 where Ian Gillan lost his voice screaming and it was very embarrassing and was taking off you tube. They sang three songs SOTW and Hush was the other two which was not very embarrassing as Ian lowered his screaming.
November 4th, 2022 at 10:34Peace ✌️
@ Uwe: Indeed you’re right. I was never satisfied with the sound of “Rising”, wether the vinyl nor the cd. The sound is “flat”, can’t hear the bass at all and dear Cozy is overdoing his drumplay sometimes. Listen to the “Stranger in us all”-album with some filler songs, but the production is much more dynamic.
Have a nice Day!
November 4th, 2022 at 12:56I don’t know what possessed whoever mixed Rising to let it out that way. With vinyl, the quality of bass generally suffers for physical reasons if an album is too long and the grooves get crammed – anything above 20 minutes or so on each side is deemed critical with louder music, but Rising is a scarce 33:28, sort of a glorified EP! It could have had a HUGE bass sound just for that.
November 4th, 2022 at 16:04Somewhere in my vaults I do have an interview with Ritchie anno 1976 from Dutch musicmonthly Muziekkrant Oor.
I do recall him playing something in his dressingroom when it came to the question how he picked a bassplayer for Rainbow.
November 4th, 2022 at 21:19I never knew what to think of it but according to the interviewe it reminded him of STATUS QUO.
RV, Ritchie possibly thought the bass on Wild Side of Life (released 1976) sounded faintly familiar …
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgK2AYh0gd0
And it should have, that’s Roger Glover playing, not Alan Lancaster (who mimes on the vid) who was in Australia at the time. But he liked the way Roger had tried to emulate his style so much upon his return to England, he left the bass track as is.
Interestingly, Jimmy Bain was a great Quo fan. So much he contaminated Tony Carey with it (who as a Yank had never heard of the mighty Quo, but had to listen to Jimmy’s mix tapes over and over on the Rainbow tours). Tony – a German resident since leaving Rainbow – still posts on the Status Quo Board as ‘Blue Highway’, i.e. named after one of his 80ies solo albums.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80Lx0Vct-K0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8svM350OqFs
And Francis Rossi is on reord for stating that he dislikes heavy rock and heavy metal – with one notable exception: Rainbow.
November 5th, 2022 at 00:32@3 Yo, back-in-the-day, through the 1970’s, stereo’s were developing to an extraordinary degree with lot’s of power available, & BIG tower speakers being the “in thing”…Often recordings were lacking in the bass dept. with the heavier musical styles, so to allow the excessive volume levels being played to be enjoyed without the break-up / speaker distortion that can be experienced…Not all sound-systems are made equal…
Put simply, the less bass in the mix, the louder you can crank the volume without break-up at party-time !
Peace !
November 5th, 2022 at 00:59As we age we get wiser but everything else eventually gets worse. It’s human aging. Ian Gillan in his prime was the best rock singer there ever was. The older wiser Ian has figured out how to adapt and make it work.
November 5th, 2022 at 03:41Uwe
I do remember telling people I was thinking of seeing QUO live early 80s I was snubbed.
I did not go, still regret that.
Also did not see the reunion which I felt was too far away or in a bad hall, dunno….
Weird I saw them with the touring band at a festival.
Rossi was looking akward at me, maybe because I wore a ponytail , same haircolour and a white shirt…..
I wasnt that bald though. Must have been the Arrow Classic Rock Festival in 2003, I think.
Around 2007 my hair was as long as Gillan used to have.
Since its been a decline.
Love gave me wings and left me paralysed…..
DP was there and I was frustrated they didnt do I m Alone
November 5th, 2022 at 22:21“Can I have everything louder than everything else!”
Have a nice Day!
November 6th, 2022 at 14:49It was never easy being a Quo fan, people would smile knowingly and generally view you as somewhat intellectually incapacitated. With Purple you at least always had the credit of their instrumental prowess, no one would have viewed Jon Lord, Ritchie Blackmore or Ian Paice as anythoing less than excellent musicians, even if they otherwise disliked hard rock.
That said, Quo as a band are underestimated as musicians
November 6th, 2022 at 20:15I used to own the Status Quo albums, Piledriver, Hello, Quo & On The Level. I even owned two Kiss albums, Hotter Than Hell & the double live album Kiss
November 7th, 2022 at 00:19Alive I think was the title. Fancy admitting that here at a Deep Purple site. By the late 1970’s I gave the albums away to a friend who really liked them also. I was evolving into the progressive bands by then. Having said that a friend of mine about 65 years old now is still a rabid Quo fan & he never misses them when they are in town. I remember him telling me, ‘there is something special about being at a Quo gig waiting for the band to start & the anticipation is building & then you hear that riff da, da, da, da, da, da etc & the venue explodes in raptures & the audience are all in sync bopping up & down etc’. Live concerts can have those special moments. Cheers.
“Fancy admitting that here at a Deep Purple site.”
We won’t tell, promise! (I own all Kiss albums, but don’t have a Kiss refrigerator in a coffin look at home.)
Kiss are neither as bad as their haters want you to believe nor as great as their fans like to gush. A lot of their stuff is hit and miss, but there are gems among it too. I’ve never been a fan, but I always took an interest in what they do and how they evolved. Gene Simmons would also make an entertaining if sometimes outrageous dinner guest I believe.
Is there really still a ranking that liking DP is ok, but liking Quo or Kiss is somewhat naff? Ironically, all three bands are adamant about not being heavy metal, yet are generally regarded as such by people with only a passing interest in heavier music. And only Kiss havn’t played Wacken yet.
November 7th, 2022 at 13:01Speaking of Heavy Metal, two days ago Judas Priest showed the music world
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rpq9MvlvP7Q
how you can be inclusive and dignified at a RRHoF induction, inviting ex-members to play with them on stage who had left 43 (!) years ago [Les Binks, the second drummer on the left, who only played on two studio and one live album(s)] or been engaged in a nasty war of words with the band more recently [KK Downing, who left in 2011, the second, less tall Flying V player].
And evem Richie Faulkner (tall and bearded Flying V player), their man in a Steve Morse role, who could not be inducted for formal reasons, stood with them on stage while the individual inductees gave their thank you speeches.
Plus they chose the more simple songs of their repertoire so that Glenn Tipton (guitarist to the right with cap), their musical mastermind for decades – their Ritchie Blackmore if you like – who now suffers severely from Parkinson’s disease, could play along.
Way to go and heart-warming. It can be done if you want to and get behind it.
November 7th, 2022 at 14:16Nice to see the Priest members bury the hatchet, I have been keeping an eye on proceedings of late. Glenn Tipton, bless him & that is so cruel what is happening to him. He was the really melodic guitarist in Priest to my ears. Sure they both played off each other & duelling guitars also, but he was the one I like more, not that Downing is any slouch. As Steve Morse said re DP ‘reunion’, ‘why can’t people just get together & hug each other & play a little music’, something along those lines. Thanks for the link. Cheers.
November 7th, 2022 at 21:10@15 Good information right there, plus these bands have been around now long enough to garner respect, for time in the business alone. I love the comment that “KISS aren’t as bad as the haters want you to think, or as great as the fans like to gush” lol !…That is true, but great entertainers they will remain, & imo, the first live album “Alive” is right up there with MIJ, & also set the precedence for their ensuing career. I’ve seen them live a few times now, & undoubtedly the most surprising & impressive show, was the “KISS my ass down-under tour” circa 1996(?), where they were unmasked, no gimmicks, & their music rocked the place to its very core…If they wrote more tunes along-the-lines of “100,000-years”, they’d have an even greater respected back-catalog of music within the prog-world, but they still punched out solid, heavy R&R in every decade imo. There’s no doubt that Ace Frehley & Paul Stanley were great “riff-makers”, right-up-there with Ritchie & DP for sure.
Peace !
November 7th, 2022 at 21:58@2 I did a mix of Stargazer: Took all 3 versions off the remastered CD (so no dreaded MP3 compression) to see which is best. The NY mix if F***ing awful as many have pointed out. The bass track produced by Moises is so low in the mix that it’s non-audible. Whoever did that should be ashamed of themselves!
The LA mix is far better and the bass is a good level. I also got the rough mix from CD2 but it is much the same as the LA mix in terms of signal quality.
I put the original track (LA) and the new bass track into PreSonus Studio: Basically a far advanced version of Audacity. I added a bit of compression and EQd it a bit to take off the top end.
Then I mixed it. I start off too loud and gradually reduce it until it fits. Then I mute the track to hear the difference. Here’s the rub: when I muted it I could not hear a noticeable difference. If I upped in the mix then it was too loud: My only conclusion is that the LA mix has a good level of bass. The spectrum analyzer shows it tails off at about 100Hz so I EQed accordingly. I’ll have another go when I get the chance.
BTW: I am NOT a professional so this is all just for fun and there is a possibility that I do not know what I am doing (wouldn’t be the first time) .
Cheers & Beers
Matthew
November 8th, 2022 at 09:15KK Downing was the heart of Priest, but Glenn Tipton was the brains. He was a technically exquisite and very tasteful lead guitarist (not much of an improviser, Priest’s music is too rigid for that), totally underrated. KK otoh was the spit and vinegar in Priest, but he is obviously limited in his lead guitar capabilities if you measure him against your standard heavy metal axeslinger. I still love him for what he brought to Priest. They really should let him rejoin.
If a Kiss gig can’t entertain you, go see a doctor to check whether you might already be dead!!! Yes, it’s corny, and yes, the band tend to be musically heavy-handed in what they do, but it’s also life-affirmingly good.
But I have to take issue with rating “Kiss Alive” with “Made in Japan”, lieber Gregster! MiJ was an undoctored, yet brilliant snapshot of Purple’s live prowess that came about by acccident while Alive was calculated marketing and about as live as Frampton Comes Alive, Priest’s Unleashed in the East or Thin Lizzy’s Live & Dangerous, meaning it consists mostly of studio and soundcheck recordings with the audience added in the aftermath. Not even the iconic sleeve of Kiss in “live” action is truly live – it was shot at a soundcheck. Doesn’t change the fact though that Alive is rightfully a piece of rock history.
There are quite a few Kiss albums I really like: the debut (for its naive charm), Dressed to Kill (their first attempt to be melodic), Destroyer (their Sgt. Pepper), Dynasty (nothing wrong with a little disco!), The Elder (yes, I have a soft spot for failed ambition), Crazy Nights (Kiss goes AOR), Revenge (a return to strength with largely good songwriting especially by Simmons) and even Carnival of Souls (an East Coast Soundgarden anyone?) + Psycho Circus (let’s put the glam back!).
November 8th, 2022 at 10:45@19…Don’t be too hard on your remix…Listen to it ( if possible ) on other peoples stereos, as that’s where your changes may be heard better, on different equipment.
I know at least with my “West Bruce & Laing” bootleg’s that I’ve redone, that they now sound consistent to one-another, are capable of being enjoyed at soft & loud volume settings without “hurting your ears”, & have brought enjoyment back to listening to some very raw, & yet energetic shows…It’s true that “you can’t make a silk-purse out-of-a sows-ear”, but you can turn something that’s pretty-raw & hurtful to your ears into a far-more enjoyable, & listenable experience.
@20…There’s a KISS bootleg containing 4-shows from across the decades from Stormbird records called “Gods of Thunder” that’s quite revealing about early KISS shows, having a show from 1974 in Cleveland onboard, which was the main reason of purchase. It was a short show, so I wanted it as something I could put-on if I didn’t have the time to listen to “Alive” from start-to-finish, as it’s a double-album. Anyhow, the show is great, & is what I call a “warts & all” recording, where all the real-life-hassles of a show present themselves, with out-of-tune guitar & vocals here & there, strange moments happening, different musical arrangements etc etc, & no doubt reaffirms your comments about the 1st live album being heavily doctored when compared…But doctoring aside, “Alive” is still a great listen, & the vibe given-off reminds me very much of MIJ, even if it’s been blended that way.
MIJ is “the” stand alone, best live album that I have to this day, ever heard, with MIE not far behind.
The other shows in the Stormbird disc-set feature the different line-up’s KISS had to endure through the 1980’s & 90’s, & are raw radio-broadcasts too, but the energy captured is very real, & makes these well worth acquiring…In fact, KISS themselves are offering at very reasonable prices new live offerings known as the “Soundboard series” from their website, & I acquired a full show from “Des Moines from 1977”, & it’s a great full show, warts & all, that compliments “Alive-II”, just as the Cleveland bootleg compliments “Alive”. I thought that the sound would be better being a “soundboard” recording, but think of it as satisfactory bootleg quality of the times. The show is very-high energy, & there’s other offerings too, for those interested in this material.
You’ve picked-out some great studio offerings in your post, & “Monster” is quite a good record too.
Peace !
November 8th, 2022 at 22:08The way Kiss had to jump about, it isn’t fair to expect from them a faultless live recording. It’s almost like seeing a dance act like Ariana Grande or Beyoncé and complaining that they are not singing live all the time. You try singing and moving about like them!
Gene Simmons is a severely underrated bassist though. All his (sometimes very perceptive and regularly entertaining) bigmouthing tends to obscure that.
November 9th, 2022 at 19:21@22 Absolutely correct about Gene & his bass playing prowess. He always managed to find the “right” lines to play, that’s for sure. In fact, a bulk of their music is very-well arranged, with lots of room for the music to breathe, whilst featuring time for everyone to shine-in-the-moment…An early tune like “Detroit Rock City” displays these attributes, if one finds the time to investigate what’s going on…
And this is another feature of DP’s music too, with everyone supporting the tune when needed, whilst also allowing room to breathe through solo’s & quieter passages.
I dare say that this is what the latest AI program is also designed to allow one to enhance if needed to ones tastes.
Interestingly, this weeks update from Discjapan.com has revealed that this AI technology is being used with the latest offerings from them, namely the current best seller being the “Beatles Revolver” sessions…And also, there’s a 1979 KISS soundboard release fresh-off-the-presses too LOL !
Peace !
November 9th, 2022 at 23:21Unmasked, wasnt that around early 80 s?
I saw the reuniontour in 96, I had no computer and we, waiting for hours in line, were reliant on the officeclerk who had the connection with wherever the tickets came.
He arrived late, it was weekend, and so we were fooked.
November 11th, 2022 at 20:38No arenatickets but seeing the bandfrom far away defintely added to the feeling seeing the 1977 LOVE GUN stageshow replicated
@24 Yes, “Unmasked” was a 1980 release, & is sadly a grossly underappreciated album imo. It’s up-beat all-the-way through, & apart from the hit “Shandi”, the album lost the “disco-flavor” found on “Dynasty” for a harder-edge, but yet radio-friendly sounding album. There’s no filler imo on “Unmasked”, simply put-it-on, & turn-it-up lol ! All the songs are memorable, catchy, & make you want to sing-along with them, so they got the right elements together again imo, but people were likely “over” the band by this stage, & didn’t catch-on…
“Creatures of the Night” from 1982 is where they found their feet again, & haven’t made a dud since imo. This album kicks ass big-time.
Too bad about the delayed ticket arrival for the 1996 show, but them’s-the-breaks sometimes…I heard them in a similar fashion near the now sadly demolished VFL-park in Melbourne, on November 15th 1980…
Peace !
November 14th, 2022 at 09:57